[dankcushions]

[quote=102055]You have scaled the overlay in gimp using linear filter. If you zoom in, you will see that this results in a blurring effect and alters the appearance of the scanlines in an irregular fashion. In addition, I think this darkens the image more.[/quote]yes, i understand how linear filtering works, thanks :) I have shown screenshots with the end result. The scanlines are fine for me, especially at my preferred brightness.

[quote]It may not be noticeable except when vertically scrolling, when it can be very distracting. The moire effect you describe fits the description of exactly what occurs when you use linear filter on the overlay in gimp or photoshop. You want to use “nearest” or “none” to avoid this.
[/quote]nope, as I say below, I got that effect when perfect 1px scanlines and integer scaling on – it’s totally a feature of my TV. using a ‘nearest’ filter would make it look awful – you get 2 pixel-thick scanlines every so often.

[quote]
The games were designed with overscan in mind- the safe area is 90% of the vertical area on an NTSC CRT. So if you integer scale 240 by 5x to get 1200, you lose 120 lines on a 1080p display, or exactly 10% of the vertical area. So what gets cropped corresponds exactly to the overscan area, which is perfect. You don’t want to see overscan, do you? [/quote]

you’re confusing ‘overscan’ with the recommended ‘safe area’. eg, snes output 240 lines (standard NTSC signal), which comes out as:

0-6 (safe overscan area – can hide tiling garbage here)
6-12 (most TVs will show this)
12-228 (216 pixel ‘safe’ area – ALL tvs will show this. all important gameplay-critical stuff should be in here)
228-224 (most TVs will show this)
232-240 (safe overscan aree – can hide tiling garbage here)

so most games show important graphics only in the centre-most 216, but they will normally still render the playing field up to 224. given that most consumer CRTS (especially as we edge into the 90s) showed the centre 224 with increasingly tighter tolerance, showing the full 224 is more ‘realistic’ than just emulating a rubbish TV :) eg, see my sonic screenshot – there’s non-glitched graphics across the entire 224 lines.

in the mame/neogeo/mvs area, this is very different – these games seem to almost always have important information running up to the edges of the 224 lines – my theory is that arcade CRTs were more of a known-quantity, so they didn’t have to worry about consumer TV variance. a 5x integer scale for these games cuts into the scores, credits, health-bars, etc. see my windjammers screenshot for an example.

[quote]I think there’s an option to display frame rate under video settings[/quote]the frame rate feature doesn’t seem to work – said this above.

[dankcushions]

the pcsx-reArmed emulator supplied with retropie is a fairly ‘pure’ experience, and doesn’t let you do too much with the graphics. other than the ‘enhanced resolution’ setting you’ve already found. i found that option alone added sound distortion, so you might find performance hitches with it turned on. also, it didn’t appear to make any improvement to games which already run in the PS1’s “high” resolution mode (eg, Tekken 3). i suppose it just forces that mode on games that don’t use it?

for filters, there’s so many that it’s difficult to recommend one. almost all of them will crush your framerate. i use the ‘dotmask’ filter, but it’s a very subtle effect, more about authenticity than anything else. you might want a scanline overlay (see the various threads of this), but again, more of authenticity thing.

to save your settings: Frontend Settings > Configuration Settings > Save Config on exit to ON (this saves to the config when we exit the game – might want to turn this off later, in case you mess anything up later by accident)

[dankcushions]

[quote=101987]With these settings, the overlay is being scaled with bilinear filter, which is blurring some of the scanlines and causing the moire effect you were describing. IMO this can be very distracting, particularly with vertically scrolling games.[/quote]
nope, it’s not being scaled. my overlays are 1080p, so if you set your retroarch video output to 1080p, no scaling takes place. i have scaled the scanlines ahead of time in gimp, but it seems to be a subtler effect, and not noticeable (to me) – see my screenshots.

the moire effect i’m describing is a feature of my TV (and others?) – i get it even when I’m using perfectly scaled 216 visible line games and 216 scanlines (5 x 216 = 1080 – I used a 1080p overlay of un-scaled 216 line scanlines, intiially), when the overlay opacity is too high. i think my panel doesn’t like concentric horizontal black lines and the brightness of them seems to waver (I have it set to ‘game mode’/post-processing off, of course).

i recommend folk fiddle with the setting to see what they like.

There are a couple incorrect assumptions you’re making, one of which is that most systems put out 224 horizontal lines of resolution, which is not the case.

…hence i’ve got the breakout section detailing the resolution of each system, as I check :) nes/snes, neogeo and megadrive are 224, which represents ‘most’ to me, but that’s my era I suppose.

[quote]If you’re losing important score/credit info, as you said you were at 5x scale, it’s likely because you are using 224 as the internal resolution instead of 240.[/quote]
nope, I was using 216 instead of 224, in the scenario I was talking about (this is the visible area you end up with when trying to 5x integer scale on a 224 line system). you can’t show 224 lines on a 1080p screen in a 5x integer scale (5*224=1120)

[quote]Also, regarding opacity, IMO you’re better off setting your display’s “backlight” setting higher to compensate for the loss of brightness. (This is not the same as the “brightness” setting). For example, with 4x scanlines at 100%, you would lose 50% light output, so you compensate for this by increasing the backlight by the same amount (eg., if your backlight is at 50%, you would turn it up to 100%).[/quote]My TV doesn’t have this setting :(

[quote]Also, regarding the dotmask shader, it will cause a drop in frame rate and input lag, but it is slight. I’m sensitive to these things, so it ruins it for me, personally.[/quote]Do you have a way of measuring this? None of the retroarch emulators seem to be able to display framerate for me.

[quote]With this said, could you please correct the misinformation contained in your post regarding the horizontal resolution of console systems? This kind of information can quickly and easily spread once posted, leading to more confusion and problems, and it works against the efforts of those who are working to preserve authenticity and accuracy. Thank you.

The correct horizontal resolution is 240 for NES, SNES, Genesis, PS1, N64, PC Engine. This can be readily corroborated by using Google and searching “internal resolution (system name)”

However, there are individual core differences and bugs where the internal resolution isn’t right, Picodrive being a notable example. So the correct resolution for a system may not be the “correct” resolution for an emulator.[/quote]sure, I’ve added a note on what I mean by ‘resolution’ in this guide

[dankcushions]

links aren’t working for me bud

[dankcushions]

looks like there’s something wrong with the imame4all-libretro sheet – everything in, and right of the ‘parent’ column seems wrong – I noticed the issue around ‘moon walker’ – not sure exactly what the issue is, but it seems like it’s localised to those few rows (?)

[dankcushions]

I actually just backed up my SD card :)

Yeah so these instructions are only for libretro/retroarch systems – they’re the only ones that support custom overlay images (as far as I can tell).

I’ve added a table above to show what overlay should be used with each system – I’ll have to add to this as I test/research.

[dankcushions]

Feel free! I’m afraid I don’t have the nerve to run it as I’ve made so many changes to my configs!

Been trying these settings out in the imame4all libretro core. A few mame games seem to run at 240 resolution, so I’ve created scanlines for that also. I’ll upload those to my top post.

[dankcushions]

added no clone, no neogeo dat files for both mame4all cores. halves the game list for those!

also added to the wiki https://github.com/RetroPie/RetroPie-Setup/wiki/Managing-ROMs

still not quite sure how to split the fba and mame lists so they don’t have a crossover. I’m not sure there’s a smart way to do it.

[dankcushions]

cheers, added them to the proper thread. again, can you do any further datfile updates there rather than this one? https://www.petrockblock.com/forums/topic/howto-use-datfiles-to-eliminate-clones-etc-from-mamefbaneogeo/#post-101717

the thread we’re in is for testing working/non-working mame stuff

[dankcushions]

Added pifba (thanks to ekstreme)

[dankcushions]

thanks. i’ve added that to the list in the proper thread – https://www.petrockblock.com/forums/topic/howto-use-datfiles-to-eliminate-clones-etc-from-mamefbaneogeo/#post-101709

[dankcushions]

added gngeo (thanks to ekstreme)

[dankcushions]

[quote=101620]I’m not 100% familar with romlister, but it looks like it’s not going to be all that helpful as some of the older sets are pre mame xml days.

You will also need to find either the right mame binary\xml and the right ini for the right versions.

I went old skool and and just building a gngeo data now. I eye-balled it removing all clones and non-working sets:)

Stupid question. But where do I upload the dat file too once created? Sorry never edited a wiki before
[/quote]
floob posted .xml dat files for all the mame/fba emulators used in retropie: http://smartretro.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=68

it’s very easy to create datfiles from romlister with clones removed – again, please see the instructions on the other thread – https://www.petrockblock.com/forums/topic/howto-use-datfiles-to-eliminate-clones-etc-from-mamefbaneogeo/ – please also add links to your dat files there, as i asked before :) that’s where we are sorting that stuff out.

[dankcushions]

yeah I noticed that. suggest we fix and then protect all but the status columns (on all sheets): https://support.google.com/docs/answer/144687?hl=en (presume only sheet owner can do this?)

[dankcushions]

[quote=101610]This is awesome work guys, I’m very happy to add to this list as I go.

When I get the time I’m also panning on creating dats that filter all the clones and other guff. I hate polluting my game list with all roms know to man. Makes it quite un-playable.

[/quote]me too! :) when you do, please add them to this thread: https://www.petrockblock.com/forums/topic/howto-use-datfiles-to-eliminate-clones-etc-from-mamefbaneogeo/

i’ve already done some for neogeo and fba for the fba-libretro romset. it’s quite easy using romlister – takes a few mins

[dankcushions]

that was me :) good to know a summer job in my teens doing spreadsheets for surveyors wasn’t entirely wasted!

copied to all now. assume that in the gngeo sheet – all greens were ‘ok’ and not ‘untested’. that seemed to be the only sheet with any test data in it as yet – we have work to do! :)

[dankcushions]

i think 2 columns might be better, otherwise pi 2 users would’d have to add ‘tested on pi 2’ on everything they update, and if they didn’t, pi1 owners might be misled.

i guess floob has seen this now but i’ve made a dat file for lr-fba neogeo only in this thread: https://www.petrockblock.com/forums/topic/howto-use-datfiles-to-eliminate-clones-etc-from-mamefbaneogeo/

[dankcushions]

[quote=101558]Are you tempted to rip out the mahjong and pinball, lightgun games in Romlister as well?

[/quote]
for sure! i suppose it gets into personal preference territory, so we could have a few datfile variants for each system. i would definitely be interested in making datfiles to strip out the following:
– mahjong
– porn games (although these are sort of hilarious)
– hacks
– quiz games
– lightgun/trackball/etc stuff that is unplayable with a controller/stick

all that should be possible in romlister

[dankcushions]

[quote=101556]So do all Parent games work in lr-fba, otherwise this would be a pointless task. You can also filter clones and games that use Bios files etc. using ClrMAME without having to use Romlister (in the set information window settings).

[/quote]i think there might be a few rare games where the parent doesn’t work, and the clone does, but personally i’d sooner fix those as-and-when i find them, rather than deal with 100s of clones in my game lists! especially via emulationstation where it’s not always obvious what version you’re looking at.

it might be possible to do this in clrmamepro but with the dat it’s preserved for future rebuilds, rather than having to remember and enter settings in clrmamepro.

[dankcushions]

[quote=101552]This looks really useful thanks.
Can you let us know what your criteria was when refining these in Romlister so we know whats been removed?

[/quote]

sure – here’s the two searches used:

for all fba-lr, minus neogeo and clones:
!'neogeo' & (!cloneof & !sample_name= & !emulation=preliminary)

for all fba-lr neogeo minus homebrew and clones:
'neogeo' & !'<manufacturer>homebrew</manufacturer>' & !'<year>????</year>' & (!cloneof & !sample_name= & !emulation=preliminary)
(i also then had to manually delete some homebrew/prototypes from romlister, and also amend the .xml file to include the neogeo.zip bios file, as it seems to want to remove that, regardless of the search string)

i’d like to eventually have .xml files for fba-lr and mame, which don’t cross over, as right now both systems have quite a bit of overlap. personal preference, but i feel like fba is for post-1990 releases, and mame for everything before.

[dankcushions]

i think you can set a global resolution in your boot/config.txt, but i’m not sure it will help much. i think the only time you’ll be GPU-bound is when using shaders, in which case they’ll start looking weird when you lower resolution.

i think generally all performance issues in the emulators are caused by the CPU.

[dankcushions]

Great idea! it would be good to finally know what real-world difference is between the various mame emulators. eg, i’ve found that fba-lr performs fine for neogeo and fba games, and lets me use lower opacity scanlines and integer scaling, so i’m starting to use it over the apparently faster pifba emulator.

One thing though, it might be an idea to include different status columns for pi and pi 2, although i’m not sure if there’s many examples of mame/fba games that perform well on the pi 2, but not on the pi?

[dankcushions]

if you’re just plugging in controllers to it, then any powered hub should be fine, but there is a compatibility list here: http://elinux.org/RPi_Powered_USB_Hubs

i use this belkin one to power 4 iBuffalo USB controllers: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Belkin-Ultra-Powered-Power-Supply/dp/B0061RSACG

[dankcushions]

i’ve been experimenting with the “wii” scanlines overlay preset in retroarch, and it seems to line-up with each pixel, across different emulators (MD/SNES/PSX/FBA-libretro). is that normal? i don’t even have integer scaling on!

i realise that i haven’t got the “true” aspect ratios, as per this thread, but i liked the idea of filling the whole screen (vertically) if possible.

one thing i did find is that i would get strange moire effects unless i turned the overlay opacity down to .35, but i wonder if that is just my TV, or a scaling issue? it’s really annoying in piFBA and Mame4All-Pi as they don’t have retrorch’s configuration, just a single scanlines on/off setting :(

[dankcushions]

i get the same problem with the same controller too :) i thought it might be just one (i have 4 plugged in), but it sounds like it’s just a thing that happens with these controllers.

it’s strange, because the buttons aren’t sticky or sensitive, so i assume it’s just the electronics sending the signal at random.

a way i thought emulationstation could get around it would be to ignore button presses that are just one milisecond (or whatever minimum signal is possible through USB), as my guess is that would ignore all these weird missfires, but still pick up normal button presses from a real person!

I raised a ticket on emulation station’s github: https://github.com/Aloshi/EmulationStation/issues/470

[dankcushions]

[quote=99887]You can just set up a game specific config for each multitap game.

input_libretro_device_p2=1025

[/quote]

hi, just tried that custom config with lr-genesis-plus-gx for the same game (‘general chaos’) and doesn’t seem to work? I only get 1 or 2 player modes available in the game. I tried the same for mega bomberman and player 2 seems to control 2, 3 and 4.

I input it as the only line (should I have the rest of the lines from the normal config?) in the custom config option when you press ‘x’ when the rom is loading. Have I done something wrong?

[dankcushions]

[quote=99863]happy to be the guinea pig! I’m guessing the files on sourceforge are complete as they seem to be getting 100 downloads a week, but perhaps I could test?

I guess if i remove the existing pifba directory in /opt and the install the binary (never done this before so if anyone has the right command!) that should give me a clean install.

[/quote]

just to update – i’ve done this and it all worked. i can now play 4 player FBA games :) I deleted existing opt/retropie/emulators/pifba directory, so i can confirm that the latest version is complete.

for anyone else wanting to do the same before the retropie repository is updated, follow these steps:

1) download the zip @ http://sourceforge.net/projects/pifba/

2) unzip to /opt/retropie/emulators/pifba (you may want to back up your existing fba2x.cfg file first, as this will overwrite your controller settings)

3) give the two executables the correct permissions:

sudo chmod 755 fba2x
sudo chmod 755 fbacapex

4) restore your old fba2x.cfg, if you backed up via
sudo cp [backup file name] fba2x.cfg

5) if you did 4, edit fba2x.cfg to add the 3rd and 4th controllers with
sudo nano fba2x.cfg

[dankcushions]

the 16_9.zip file link is dead in the first post :(

[dankcushions]

happy to be the guinea pig! I’m guessing the files on sourceforge are complete as they seem to be getting 100 downloads a week, but perhaps I could test?

I guess if i remove the existing pifba directory in /opt and the install the binary (never done this before so if anyone has the right command!) that should give me a clean install.

[dankcushions]

cheers! ah right, i presume when i rebuild emulators from binaries/source, it just pulls whatever version you have in the mirrors, rather than the actual latest version.

could you let me know in this thread when it’s updated and i’ll give it another shot? thanks :)

[dankcushions]

if you connect a keyboard and hit the x key as the rom is loading, you can select the default emulator for neogeo games, but isn’t pifba faster the gngeo? i use it for all my neo geo games and they run top speed (although i did turn the screensmoothing/videosmoothing option off in the config file)

i heard gngeo doesn’t use the pi’s GPU, so is slower. pifba does.

[dankcushions]

i also noticed that in the video-general section of mupen64plus.cfg, the ScreenWidth was set to 640, and ScreenHeight to 480, whereas my games are definitely full hd, so i’m a bit lost. does rebuilding the emulators cause them to look somewhere else for the cfg files?

EDIT: i’ve just setup my quit emulator button with mupen in that same .cfg and it worked, so scrub that last idea!

[dankcushions]

interestingly, in the config files, the mupen64plus.cfg file has a ‘latency’ setting in the audio section at the top. this is set to 300(ms), which seemed like it might explain it. i had a look in the retroarch.cfg file in the same directory (assume this is for lr-mupen64plus, which has no audio latency issue for me) has an ‘audio_latency’ setting that was at 64

i tried setting mupen64plus.cfg to 64 also and no changes, which is a bit baffling! i’ve set it back to 300.

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